TBS Discovery FAQ - Start Here

[Jumpy07]

TBS Discovery FAQ

(This is UK biased regarding radio and video tx frequencies etc)

This is work in progress.. will add more detail as required, please post any comments / updates in this thread and will add to FAQ as required.

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The Team BlackSheep,  (TBS) TBS Discovery is a purposely designed as a FPV platform,  based on the DJI Flame Wheel F450 frame base. 

It has a asymmetric structure with wide placed arms to offer a propeller free camera view, it incorporates traces and tracks on the frame plates to minimise wiring for power, video and rx distribution.



There are mounts and space for both a flight camera and HD recording camera (normally a GoPro) in the front,  and a cage for a high capacity LiPo battery at the rear of the frame. There is also an on-board current sensor which can be connected to an optional TBS CORE, which comprises of a video and power-controller, (Including basic OSD)

Specifications

   
• Released:  TBS Discovery: June 2012  (Ver 1.0)
• Frame Type: Asymmetric Spider Quadcopter
• Centre Plate Material: Reinforced fiberglass
• Frame only size: W116 x H400 x L328 mm - (excluding arms)
• All up weight: 1300-1600 grams
• Frame with arms: 414 grams
• Frame only: 192 grams
• Frame with CORE: 198 grams
• Takeoff weight: 800 grams to 1600 grams
• Current sensor: on-board - v1.1 100A,  v1.2+ 50A 
• Battery: 3S-4S 3300-4500mAh 30C+,  single LiPo pack , 4S 4000mah ecommended
• Battery weight: 320-460 grams recommended
• Battery cage: W55 x H37 x L173 mm,  max dimensions, aim for 4-8 mm less for a good fit and for easy removal.
• Usable battery space: W55 x H31 x 173 mm 
• Suitable motors: 22 x 12 mm (Ø28x26-28mm), 22 x 16 mm (Ø28 x 30-34mm) - 22 x 16 mm recommended
• Motor mount arms: 16 x 19 mm pattern
• Propellers: 9 inch (more locked-in , less airtime) or 10 inch (more airtime, less locked-in)
• ESC: 4 x 18-30A
• Flight time: 10-15 minutes
• Center of Gravity: 15 mm forward of the bottom Center of Thrust mark
• Screws: Frame arms 24x M2.5 x 5mm, frame spacers 8x M3 x 6mm, motors 16x M3 x 8mm
• Clone arms: HJ450, RM450, Q450, FY450 

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Click here for Large resolution image of above: http://beta.ivc.no/rc_helicopter/tbs_discovery_install_rev4.pdf

Common Equipment / Builds

Flight Controllers

Although any flight controller will in theory work with the TBS Discovery, the FC of preference tends to be the Naza M + GPS. Other common FC';s are shown below:

   
• Naza M - http://www.dji-innovations.com/products/naza-multi-rotor/overview/
• APM 2.5 - http://www.unmannedtechshop.co.uk/ardupilot-mega-apm-2-5-kit.html
• Arduflyer V2.5 - http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo=goods_details.dwt&goodsid=818
• Crius AIOP - http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo=goods_details.dwt&goodsid=765
• CCD3 - http://store.openpilot.org/openpilot-hardware/1-coptercontrol.html

ESC';s

   
• DJI 30A Opto,  (do not required calibration, no BEC)
• TBS 30a (SimonK)

Motors

Typical motors are either 750kv or 900kv, The motors are rated between 150 and 220W.

   
• Tiger
• TBS - (re-badged Tiger)
• Torx MT2216 900kv: http://quadcopters.co.uk/torxpower-2216-pro-short-shaft-brushless-motor-900kv-330-p.asp
• DJI 2212, 920kv http://quadcopters.co.uk/dji-motor-2212-920kv-244-p.asp (These have an odd prop adapter)
  

Propellers

(Prop of choice is Graupner, although RcTimer full Carbon props offer a lower cost alternative)

   
• 9 x 4.7 (Rctimer: http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo=goods_details.dwt&goodsid=794&productname=)
• 9 x 5 (Graupner: http://www.electricwingman.com/graupner-elektro-propeller-9x5-pair.aspx  Rctimer: http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo=goods_details.dwt&goodsid=864&productname=)
• 10x 4.7 (Rctimer: http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo=goods_details.dwt&goodsid=799&productname=
• 10 x 5 (Graupner:  http://quadcopters.co.uk/graupner-10x5-elektro-prop-514-p.asp  Rctimer: http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo=goods_details.dwt&goodsid=782&productname=)

OSD';s

Choice of OSD is going to depend on what Flight Controller you are using in some instances. If using APM 2.5 or Arduflyer etc then MinimOSD would be your first choice. If using Naza or other FC';s then normally a standalone OSD or TBS Core is used. 

   
• Core, (basic voltage and current OSD), voltage step down and supply filtering, Manual: http://team-blacksheep.com/tbs-core-manual.pdf
• Cyclops, standalone OSD with GPS and current sensor
• ezOSD, standalone OSD with GPS and current sensor, can be expanded for antenna tracking.
• MinimumOSD , for Crius, APM & Arduflyer only.

Flight View Video Cameras

Any board type camera of dimensions 38mm x 38mm, or 32mm x 32mm will fit. A Wide Dynamic Range, (WDR) camera is recommended for FPV flights. Lens should be 2.8mm - 3.8mm depending on preference.

   
• WDR 600 / 700:  http://www.securitycamera2000.com/search.php?search_query=fpv&x=0&y=0

Batteries

Although some use 3S lipos, 4S is recommend for longer flight times. Pay attention to cage size on the frame though. 4S battery weights in the range of 390-430 grams are recommended @ 4000 mah.

   
• Zippy 4000mah 4s: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=32172
• Turnigy 4000mah 4s. 35c: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__17242__Turnigy_nano_tech_4000mah_4S_35_70C_Lipo_Pack.html

Video TX

(UK: If using 2.4ghz tx/rx control then 5.8ghz is normaly used. If using 433/459mhz tx/rx control then you have the option to use 2.4ghz for video tx)

   
• ImmersionRC,  5.8ghz 600mw - typical range with standard antenna';s = 1km - http://www.firstpersonview.co.uk/transmitters/5.8ghz/5.8ghz-long-range-transmitter
• Lawmate 2.4ghz, 500mw - typical range with standard antenna';s = 4km

TX/RX Control

Although you can use a 4 channel tx/rx, like any MultiRotor, the bare minimum should be a 6 channel. More channels may be required to switch flight modes and control cameras etc. As most FPV';ers with this frame will likely fly beyond the range of most standard 2.4ghz setups, the trends is towards UHF equipment on 433/459Mhz, (459mhz is legal UK).  This allows 2.4ghz to be used as an option for video in the UK.

UHF Tx Modules:

   
• ezUHF: http://www.immersionrc.com/EzUHF.htm
• Orange OpenLRS: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__27095__OrangeRx_Open_LRS_433MHz_TX_Module_JR_Turnigy_compatible_.html
• FlyTron OpenLRS: http://blog.flytron.com/category/openlrs-project

Useful Links

   
• Team Black Sheep: http://team-blacksheep.com/
• TBS Discovery Wiki: http://beta.ivc.no/wiki/index.php/TBS_Discovery
• Quadcopters (UK TBS dealer): http://quadcopters.co.uk/
• EzUHF: http://www.immersionrc.com/EzUHF.htm
• ImmersionRC: http://www.immersionrc.com/

Build Logs

   
• DrHankes extensive build log: http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL-VRXjfT6fSwqo1y1moaUYjX4kjFw52lZ&feature=view_all
• Jumpy07: http://www.multi-rotor.co.uk/index.php?topic=1242.0
• TBS Stop Motion Build Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIHt3qwayoQ

[RS]

As we  know , there are some  vibration issues with this  frame + DJI arms set,  that could give some jello  effect .
This is a very good solution  for Gopro cameras;
http://fpv-community.de/showthread.php?21879-Antivibrationsgel-Pads-f%FCr-Hero-1-2-3-Actionpro-SD21-%28%E4hnlich-Alpha-Gel%29

I tried myself with good  results:
Props were  not balanced  dynamically . 
Without this  gelpad  I got plenty vibrations..
http://youtu.be/wOwPwMDHBoM

[Jumpy07]

Thanks RS.. looks  like a good idea..

I have been using a tripod mount for the GoPro in its case, have used three layers of foam tape under the mount.. which seems to work ok.. also have an elastic band over the housing to the normal frame attachments.

[HighSpy]

Has anyone had an issue with the screws that came with the Discovery frame
The ones that came with mine are so soft I';m reluctant to use them...

[Jumpy07]

Has anyone had an issue with the screws that came with the Discovery frame
The ones that came with mine are so soft I';m reluctant to use them...

That was a common problem and they have since replaced the screws, speak to seller and try and get a new set

[HighSpy]

Thanks I';ll get hold of them...Good job I didn';t thread lock them down
before I realised how soft they were...

[mickyt]

I noticed this when i built mine in the end i use the dji f550 screw set as the tbs screws were crap, if there were any resistance the alan key would slip and knacker the head.

[RS]

Today I tried  Graupners  9x5 props on my TBS Disco and I have  to say  they are even better than 10x5 !
Im running sunnysky 2212  980kv motors on 4S
So first I tried Gemfan  9x4.7 props, but  on my TBS quad  they  sounded  not right . Some kind  of resonance and  vibrations ...
The  very same props on my other (spider) copter work  just fine.
Then I tried Graupners 10x5 with good results, but I still got some "jello" untill  I bought  the Gelpad.
Today I did test Graupners 9X5  and  I was surprised  that even with  out any dampenings or  anything  there were not  that  much jello .
This  is probably  because 9x5 spins a bit faster.
All  those props were balanced before testing ( not dynamically)
I really recommend to try Graupners 9x5 

This  is a short video:
http://youtu.be/62uXExYxAIE

[neagron]

  every one for a good thread and good posts,Marty.  :scotland:

[SecurityCamera2000]

  Wow, what a good posts, should be recommended for many FPV beginner!

Kind for your favor to mention our flight camera from securitycamera2000.

Anything we can help, please free to contact us. ::)