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Andy7:
23 Aug 2019 10:29:15
Nice! Looks loads better.  :beer2:
Gaza07:
22 Aug 2019 22:47:32
Sorted mate  ~~
Andy7:
22 Aug 2019 10:27:36
Sure. But basically, all the subjects are getting cut off.
Gaza07:
21 Aug 2019 18:14:54
Can you pm me a screen shot of what you mean
Andy7:
21 Aug 2019 12:15:41
Gaza - can you make the subject line section in the forum topic list wider? It's cutting off the subject field really short.
Andy7:
19 Aug 2019 09:14:20
Good for you!  ~~
DarkButterfly:
18 Aug 2019 19:13:57
Had another negative encounter, it's been a few years since the last one, just an uneducated ******, going on about drones being illegal yada yada yada.    :-/
Still that didn't spoil my flying time, had an absolute blast  ~~
Gaza07:
07 Aug 2019 19:52:01
ooooh mrs jones  :D
hoverfly:
30 Jul 2019 15:26:34
D.B. you tightwad.. :cool:
atomiclama:
29 Jul 2019 20:14:10
DB that just means you have shed loads of props in the first place ;-)
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3d - Printworx

Printing 3d Forum

My new/first quad build

Started by iWolf51, Saturday,July 20, 2013, 06:45:06

Previous topic - Next topic

iWolf51

Hi,

I said elsewhere that I';d post some photos of my new quad when I could get it in the air.
Well that';s been accomplished so heres some info and a few shots taken during assembly.

I';m really happy with the way it went together and managed to fit most of the hardware between bottom and top frame plates.
Its quite stable with the default Multiwii 2.2 firmware, after some transmitter channel adjustments.
Test flights so far have been in my back yard which is too small to really try it out.
But with 8 x 4.5 props mounted it hovers at about 50% throttle and feels like theres plenty of potential in it.
I still need to sort the gps which won';t initialiase and lock reliably and I haven';t tried the Bluetooth connection yet.

Part specs for the build are:
- Firefly 450 quad frame.
- Hobbywing Quattro 25amp 4-1 speed controller.
- Turnigy D2830/11 1000KV motors
- Props, 8", 9" or 10", to be decided
- MultiWii & Megapirate  PRO AIO Flight Controller
- NEO 6M GPS module
- Multiwii MWC FC Bluetooth Module
- Orange 6ch DSM2 receiver
- 3S 2200mah 25c flight battery.

4in1 ESC mounted on the F450 bottom frame plate.




FC mounted above the ESC. It sits on a separate base plate (from an F330 frame).



Top frame plate fitted, GPs sits on top and the Bluetooth adapter underneath.

"Takeoff is optional - Landing is compulsory"

DarrellW

Looks a very neat and tidy installation, wish mine was that tidy - looks like a rats nest by comparison  ::)  ::)  ::)
I think..........I think I am........therefore I am.............I think!

iWolf51

Quote from: DarrellW on Saturday,July 20, 2013, 07:31:34
Looks a very neat and tidy installation, wish mine was that tidy - looks like a rats nest by comparison  ::)  ::)  ::)


Thanks, its only a basic quad and making a tidy build was one thing I did want to do.
From what I';ve seen on other multis the board layout, cable routing and tie down make a big difference to how the quad looks when its finished.
I spent more than reasonable time working out a clean way to lay out the hardware and run wiring.
The result is helped a lot by using the 4in1 ESC which is a neat package and takes care of power distribution as well.
"Takeoff is optional - Landing is compulsory"

sevet

Your setup looks real neat.

The problem is: putting the Crius (?) board on the esc like this, might really kill your compass performance..... although i did read somewhere that the quatro is one of the most interference isolated as the wires connections inside are really short.

Compass problems will give you unpredictable loiter, RTL and Simple mode in megapirateng, will you be using megapirateng?

Also, if MPNG will be used, I saw you mounted the FC directly, you should consider mounting it on some vibration isolation pads.

And lastly, don';t forget to cover your barometer with some kind of sponge, beware not to glue the small hole on it.

What will you be doing with it? for 3S battery i would suggest 10" props. I don';t fly hard so I go with 5000mah battery, the 2200 lasts me only about 6-7 minutes but the response is better as it is lighter.

iWolf51

Friday,July 26, 2013, 12:37:23 #4 Last Edit: Friday,July 26, 2013, 13:34:19 by iWolf51
Quote from: sevet on Wednesday,July 24, 2013, 17:21:36
Your setup looks real neat.

The problem is: putting the Crius (?) board on the esc like this, might really kill your compass performance..... although i did read somewhere that the quatro is one of the most interference isolated as the wires connections inside are really short.

Compass problems will give you unpredictable loiter, RTL and Simple mode in megapirateng, will you be using megapirateng?

Also, if MPNG will be used, I saw you mounted the FC directly, you should consider mounting it on some vibration isolation pads.

And lastly, don';t forget to cover your barometer with some kind of sponge, beware not to glue the small hole on it.

What will you be doing with it? for 3S battery i would suggest 10" props. I don';t fly hard so I go with 5000mah battery, the 2200 lasts me only about 6-7 minutes but the response is better as it is lighter.

Thanks sevet,

neat and tight was one of my first goals with the build and I';m happy with the way it turned out.
Its the Hobbyking version of the MultiWii Pro board. As far as I can tell they run similar hardware to the CRIUS but board layout might differ a little.

I';m currently running MultiWii 2.2 and in ANGLE and HORIZON modes (normal hands on sticks flight - with self levelling) the stability and flight control is good enough for a beginner, even using the default PID settings.  I may try MPNG later if I get into FPV.

As its my first quad build I';m mainly interested in hands on sticks flight, but I do want to be able to use GPS HOLD (Loiter) and GPS HOME (RTL) modes at times.
For testing I';ve started off with 8x4.5 slowfly props and am using a 3S 2200mah batttery. This is getting about 8 minutes of mixed flight. I';ve 9x4.7 and 10.4.5 props to try when I get the my current sensor issues resolved.

Unfortunately I';m already finding how right you are about mag interference with the FC right on top of the ESC.  :wack0
The GPS is working fine, but the GPS flight modes don';t work reliably at all.

I';ve just done a motor test (props on and running from idle to WOT while tied down) with logging on, to check how much running the motors effects Mag data.
I haven';t had time to fully analyse the test logs but a quick look shows some major changes in magx, magy and magz values as the motor RPMs increase.
And that of course flows on to GPS data.

So unless someone has a better idea, I';m planning to relocate the FC to the top frame plate. Thats about 25mm (1") above the ESC, then check the mag variation again.

The FC is currently mounted using silicone fuel tube washers over nylon screws. It may be damping vibration a little, but I noticed some change to the gyro data in my test log as well.
So I';ll use foam tape when I relocate the board to the top of the frame.

Thanks again for your comments, much appreciated.  ~~

Editted and updated :smiley:
"Takeoff is optional - Landing is compulsory"

DarrellW

Make yourself a bracket to raise it a couple of inches, should work much better!
I think..........I think I am........therefore I am.............I think!

iWolf51

Quote from: DarrellW on Friday,July 26, 2013, 12:46:32
Make yourself a bracket to raise it a couple of inches, should work much better!


Thanks mate,

My previous reply got away before I finished typing it, sort of like a quad with bad GPS and mag issues.  :laugh:
I';ve just editted the previous post and updated it.

But I reckon you';re right and I';ll be relocating the FC above the top frame plate ASAP.
It';ll be interesting to see how much difference it makes.
"Takeoff is optional - Landing is compulsory"

barneyg

Def makes a difference ... I';ve not done it yet but I changed from a power distribution board to a v2 baseplate with it built in and raised the dc as far as I could with the pins sticking up and my mag interferance changed from about 35degrees @ wot to 1 or 2 degrees

DarrellW

Quote from: barneyg on Friday,July 26, 2013, 13:51:08
Def makes a difference ... I';ve not done it yet but I changed from a power distribution board to a v2 baseplate with it built in and raised the dc as far as I could with the pins sticking up and my mag interferance changed from about 35degrees @ wot to 1 or 2 degrees

Another thing to do is to calibrate the mag with the motors running full throttle, that';s how I did mine, definitely makes a difference!
I think..........I think I am........therefore I am.............I think!

barneyg

Friday,July 26, 2013, 17:00:59 #9 Last Edit: Friday,July 26, 2013, 17:04:39 by barneyg
That is a good idea ...will definitely try that at some point.

iWolf51

Thursday,August 29, 2013, 09:15:59 #10 Last Edit: Friday,August 30, 2013, 13:34:03 by iWolf51
Version 1 of my build (pics ^^) worked ok.

But the flight controller and 4-1 ESC being so close together caused some electronic noise issues for the FC.
Also the underslung battery was exposed to possible damage, as the legs on the quad aren';t long enough for that.
Plus I wanted to fit a case to protect the FC a bit, and daytime nav light to help me keep orientation of the quad.

So, it seems it was time to reconfigure the machine.
Version 2, this is it:


- HK AIOP flight controller is mounted in a hard case on top of the frame. and the GPS antenna is mounted on top of the FC case.


- Battery is fitted between the frame plates, with RC receiver (I shortened the receiver/FC harness)
- and blue tooth adapter on opposite sides of the bottom frame plate.
- The GPS unit is mounted under the top frame plate.




- Daytime nav light mounted on front of frame by an alloy bracket that also keeps the battery in place.
The lights work a treat! A steady white LED - great for picking the front of the quad, plus a blue strobe which is useless in daylight but looks pretty after dark.


- the 4-1 ESC now lives under the bottom frame plate and has a skid plate for protection. It clears the deck by about 8mm.
Theres an alloy skid plate in the pipeline to improve protection for the ESC and power wires.


We';ve had some windy weather the past couple of weeks that has pretty much had me grounded.
Its now settled down for a bit and have finally been able to get the quad back in the air.
So far the new setup is working well, noise in the FC has been reduced significantly.
The quad feels a bit more sensitive to roll/pitch with the battery mid mounted rather than under the frame.
I';m still using default PID values and its reasonably good/stable in ANGLE and HORIZON modes.
Will let you know how things progress.
"Takeoff is optional - Landing is compulsory"

teslahed

Thursday,August 29, 2013, 09:31:22 #11 Last Edit: Thursday,August 29, 2013, 10:17:39 by teslahed
That looks like a much neater setup now you';ve rearranged things.

I';m guessing you can see why i don';t like to recommend the 4 in 1 ESC to people? It makes things look neater by putting all the mess and RF interference into one large unit that you';re encouraged to mount directly underneath the flight controller itself - where all your interference prone sensors are likely to be installed.

4 individual ESCs, one on each arm, makes keeping the wiring direct and away from the flight controller a lot simpler. Lessening your RF interference has much more of a beneficial effect on a multirotor than neatening up a few wires a little bit.

There is also the fact that multitors fly much better when using speed controllers that have firmware that';s designed for flying multirotors. You can flash ESCs yourself if you don';t have the special multirotor specific firmware;

http://www.multi-rotor.co.uk/index.php?topic=1079.0

The performance difference in terms of control and stability is staggering. You';ll spend months PID tuning and not get half the improvements you';d get by upgrading to simonK ESCs.

but it';s very fiddly to do with that 4 in 1 unit you have. You have to use the ';BLHeli'; firmware instead of ';SimonK'; and the soldering is a lot trickier.
One circlip short of a quadcopter.
 1 lobe short of an antenna.

iWolf51

Thanks teslahed.

I';m happy with the revised layout, a bit of experience and some solid advice is making a difference.

As for other ESCs and firmware changes, I';m happy with the Hobbywing Quattro for this build.
I chose it for its simplicity of installation and because its (allegedly) optimised for quad use.
Separate SimonK ESCs might outperform the 4-1, but from what I';ve read online the 4-1 delivers many of the benefits out of the box.
Either way, as a quad trainer it';ll do everything I want it to do.
That said I';m thinking about an acro quad for my next build and that will use 4 separate SimonK ESCs.
"Takeoff is optional - Landing is compulsory"

Tony Campbell

Quote from: DarrellW on Saturday,July 20, 2013, 07:31:34
Looks a very neat and tidy installation, wish mine was that tidy - looks like a rats nest by comparison  ::)  ::)  ::)


Lol, mine too!!! I';d really like to start afresh but the IFLY4 frame I';ve canabalised is a bit limiting. I must get a new frame soon.