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3d - Printworx

Printing 3d Forum

Bixler 2 by Raf

Started by Raf, Tuesday,August 11, 2015, 18:17:30

Previous topic - Next topic

Raf

Tuesday,August 11, 2015, 18:17:30 Last Edit: Tuesday,August 11, 2015, 20:02:42 by Raf
Finally I have got Bixler 2 probably after a year of lurking at it, watching videos.
I have no experience with fixed wing whatsoever so will take it steady.
As I think I know what I expect from it I chosen to go with kit version and some "upgraded" bits.
Now I';m waiting for bits and peaces to start strengthening process but already started to plan modifications.

Kit itself - already started removing graphics, they peel off so easily and linkages for rudder and elevator - servos will be installed in the tail.

[attach=1]

Bits that come together. Digital servos 45A ESC and MTN28-36 1800kv motor - will be running 4S and swinging 6x4 prop.

[attach=2]

I have APMmini harvested off one of my previous builds that will go into it.

[attach=3]

...to be continued

Friskle

Personally i would have gone for the 2200kv motor, as it performs very well on that one, and much better than stock, i never really did much to mine, no reinforcements at all anywhere, and its always come out pretty unscathed after a rough`ish landing, half of the mods are unnecessary really, but people do what they see fit :)

Chuck off at around 45° and about 3 quarter throttle, and should be fine, its a nice easy plane to fly, though dont fly mine as much as i should really, it glides very well, longest from mine with a 2200mah batt, before i got a bit bored was over 30 mins, was a good day for gliders, plenty of thermals.
Yuneec Q500+
Yuneec Typhoon H
Nano QX2
Nano QX3D
Blade 180QX
Blade 200QX
DJI 450 frame + Naza M V2 = GPS
ZMR 250
250 Pro - Dys 2300kv motors , Naze32 Acro
300 Folding Frame sporting a Naza Lite + GPS

wobblybob

I know some of the fixed wing and scale model flyers look down on the FPV multi rotor crowd but I must admit been eyeing up a bixler after chatting to a fella on the local rec fields who fly';s one . I';m feeling drawn to giving a fixed wing a go and the bixler is what I have my eye on for an intro .
Keep posting up dates  may be convince me to take the plunge , ~~
Alien frame,Emax 2213 935 KV motors Emax 30amp ESC,AMP2.7,X8R Rx,

Friskle

The Bixler, is a very good starter plane indeed, i buddied a fella with mine, and he was flying on his own in 30 minutes, a few hiccups here and there, but ok all the same, it just flies well, and without any real fuss at all, if your thinking of a fixed wing starter, Bixler 2 is definately one of the best choices, but dont be tempted by the Bixler 3, it no where near as good as its predecessor.
Yuneec Q500+
Yuneec Typhoon H
Nano QX2
Nano QX3D
Blade 180QX
Blade 200QX
DJI 450 frame + Naza M V2 = GPS
ZMR 250
250 Pro - Dys 2300kv motors , Naze32 Acro
300 Folding Frame sporting a Naza Lite + GPS

Raf

Quote from: Friskle on Tuesday,August 11, 2015, 18:26:08
Personally i would have gone for the 2200kv motor, as it performs very well on that one, and much better than stock, i never really did much to mine, no reinforcements at all anywhere, and its always come out pretty unscathed after a rough`ish landing, half of the mods are unnecessary really, but people do what they see fit :)


For LOS flying stock setup Bixler is strong enough I';m not arguing that but I';m planning FPV gear, GoPro,2600-3300mAh 4S battery and with all that added weight strange things can happen. I don';t think I';m going to over do it but alterations are needed and fuselage structure will be weaker due to APM installation and servo relocation. Spar replacement as stock is bend and will bend more with extra few hundreds gram on top. I think 1800v should be a good balance between power and endurance and can turn 6" or 7" prop on 4S

Quote from: wobblybob on Tuesday,August 11, 2015, 19:52:40
I know some of the fixed wing and scale model flyers look down on the FPV multi rotor crowd but I must admit been eyeing up a bixler after chatting to a fella on the local rec fields who fly';s one . I';m feeling drawn to giving a fixed wing a go and the bixler is what I have my eye on for an intro .
Keep posting up dates  may be convince me to take the plunge , ~~


That';s exactly where I';m coming from.

Friskle

well i was not actually arguing anything myself, was merely mentioning the 2200kv performs very well, i mentioned that motor size only because thats what i changed mine to when i was carrying the Hero 1 and VTX as i used the Gopro for the FPV viewing, and it did very well indeed.



Yuneec Q500+
Yuneec Typhoon H
Nano QX2
Nano QX3D
Blade 180QX
Blade 200QX
DJI 450 frame + Naza M V2 = GPS
ZMR 250
250 Pro - Dys 2300kv motors , Naze32 Acro
300 Folding Frame sporting a Naza Lite + GPS

DarrellW

Another alternative to look at is the AXN Floater Jet, very similar animal but arguably a bit tougher. Bruce (RCMODELREVIEWS ) swears by them! Not built my new one yet, the old one took a right load of abuse and I like them so much I just had to have another.
It';s also similar to my Multiplex Easystar 2 but that';s like a graceful old lady compared to the AXN  ::)
I think..........I think I am........therefore I am.............I think!

dp106

If you';ve never flown fixed wing before you would be better off forgetting all the fpv gear, go pro and strengthening and just get it in the air and do some los practice.  With all the extra weight you are going to have an unwieldy beast for a first time plane to fly.

Friskle

Quote from: dp106 on Tuesday,August 11, 2015, 22:41:52
If you';ve never flown fixed wing before you would be better off forgetting all the fpv gear, go pro and strengthening and just get it in the air and do some los practice.  With all the extra weight you are going to have an unwieldy beast for a first time plane to fly.


i would agree with that.
Yuneec Q500+
Yuneec Typhoon H
Nano QX2
Nano QX3D
Blade 180QX
Blade 200QX
DJI 450 frame + Naza M V2 = GPS
ZMR 250
250 Pro - Dys 2300kv motors , Naze32 Acro
300 Folding Frame sporting a Naza Lite + GPS

Two-Six

I have an AXN and a Bixler II.  With the Bixler I put a carbon fibre rod in the horizontal stabiliser, not sure why actually.  In fact it wasn';t the best idea.  It was a pain to do and looked crap. 
Be careful not to disrupt the way the tail fits onto the end of the fuselage if you do that, make it nice and flush with the surface of the H-stab.  I glued the tail on wonky the first time and had to take it apart again after the glue went off...Not recommended!

I also did something to the tube in the wing, I glued a CF rod in it I think.  The stock one un-beefed up IS too weak especially if you put FPV gear in it.

Also put some strong tape along the bottom of it and hold your canopy on with tape :-)  it falls of.

Another great mod is putting plastic pressure tube over the screws that hold the wing on.

It makes putting them in and taking them out really easy.  Arrange it so that the tubing JUST pokes out of the fuselage when fully screwed in.  Push the screw head into the other end of the tube and expoxy them in from the underside of the screw head so you can still put a screw driver down the tube and fit it in the slots on the screw head.

Use plenty of hot glue to fix in your servos, use velcro to hold your RX and stuff in place.  This doesn';t stick very well to foam BTW so use epoxy or foam safe cyano to stick the velcro pads in place.

If you use flaps, it pitches up quite a bit with the flaps deployed, use some elevator compensation, some ppl like to program crow braking, also in your ESC put the prop brake ON so it stops spinning on engine off.  Much more efficient.

Its a great plane.  The stickers are totally crap.  Do your self a favour and take them of right now before they end up stuck all over everything and paint some funky scheme on it with acrylic paint.  My mate went for neon blue and green sprayed on like tiger stripes, it looked great :-)  I went for day-glow orange panels on the wing tips.

Oh yeah another good thing to do it don';t stick those foam strips over the slot in the wing.  If you do you wont be able to change a broken servo very easily.  Just put some strong duct tape over the slots and servos. 

I got some great bright red stuff from Wilco.

Nighthawk Pro, Trex 450 L Dominator 6 cell *FLOWN*, Blade 450-3D, MCPX-BL, MCPX-V2, Hubsan X4, Seagull Boomerang IC .40 trainer, HK Bixler, AXN Clouds fly,, Spektrum DX7, Taranis, AccuRC

gb0wers

There is a lot of good advice in this thread and here is my tuppence worth.

Definitely upgrade the wing spar. Even if its the only thing you do. Some change it our for a rod, some glue a 4mm rod inside the stock tube. Mine has a length of 4mm piano wire glued in the middle section that I had to retrofit after the wings were glued in and the spar failed in a simple LoS launching crash - I accidentally killed the motor whilst self launching as I knocked the motor safe switch. I had to cut into the wingtip so gain access to the end of the spar and was lucky enough that the failure was a series of cracks that ran along the length of the spar.

Consider uhu por as it stays flexible, don';t use as a contact, use it like epoxy for example but it takes hours to dry - best leave overnight. Mine is totally assembled with it. Even if you prefer other adhesives for the main assembly, a film of it makes a great base for self adhesive velcro.

I think the advice about learning FW without the weight of FPV gear is spot on as light models fly better and mine is better mannered without fpv gear. But that doesn';t mean you can';t add fpv gear later. If you choose this path then I';d advise designing your fpv installation at the outset so you know where all the bits are going to go, thus you can manage the CoG and ensure you have space to put things. For example my VTx is on the tail boom, some of the gubbins is in the fuz under the wing. I guess it would be easy enough to mod the tail boom later, but cutting away foam inside the fuz under the wing is best done at build time. I found enough space and got the CoG spot on with the tail servos in their intended location by the way. I did cut in a side hatch and am in the process of putting in an ET Vector there.

I got rid of the wing attachment tubes that are in the fuz as part of the effort to create space there and permanently glued the wings in, which stiffens the structure up. There may be a way to get rid of the joiner screws from underneath that doesn';t involve glueing the wings in but I didn';t seek that path.

I know you';ve already bought the motor, but at least be aware of alternatives so you can change later if you want. Its possible to fit larger props and lower Kv motors by raising the motor thrust line. Bigger props turning slower are both more efficient and quieter. I';m currently running a 10x5 on a 1040 Kv motor and 3S and get 20 minutes LoS out of a 2200 mAh LiPo.
http://smallpartscnc.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=20&product_id=135
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:256170
I';m using the printed spigot but with a 6mm ply flange plate. I did have a printed flange plate but it fractured - possibly because it was printed with a honeycomb structure , not solid.

Finally, Rangler has blogged Bix2 build stuff in some detail http://rangler.co.uk/category/b2/
I used some of his work as inspiration copied some of the ideas he has documented in my build. The Bix2 was down to £25 quid in the sale and so so almost bought another one...........its a great model even at £35.

Graham


Friskle

Totally agree with the UHU POR, best glue to use, even over hot glue imho, all my electric foam planes where they have to be Held in with Glue are all held with UHU POR, as you say, just use normally, takes longer to set, but then still sets rubbery, but the the servo will never move in use, and far easier to remove after using UHU POR.
Yuneec Q500+
Yuneec Typhoon H
Nano QX2
Nano QX3D
Blade 180QX
Blade 200QX
DJI 450 frame + Naza M V2 = GPS
ZMR 250
250 Pro - Dys 2300kv motors , Naze32 Acro
300 Folding Frame sporting a Naza Lite + GPS

Two-Six

Actually I am going to replace my Spektrum radio gear in mine to my new Frsky X8R with a vario module :-)

I want to experiment with the Taranis programming and the Bix will be a great test bed for all kinds of neat things, like crow braking, aileron differential, throttle/elevator mixing, flap, elevator mixing, flap reflex, analogue flap control on a POT, expo and DR';s.

Its got to be done.
Nighthawk Pro, Trex 450 L Dominator 6 cell *FLOWN*, Blade 450-3D, MCPX-BL, MCPX-V2, Hubsan X4, Seagull Boomerang IC .40 trainer, HK Bixler, AXN Clouds fly,, Spektrum DX7, Taranis, AccuRC

Raf

Wednesday,August 12, 2015, 13:09:29 #13 Last Edit: Wednesday,August 12, 2015, 13:27:28 by Raf
Thanks to everyone for great advise. I will be definitely starting with LOS flying without all FPV gear but it will be ready for it. Strengthening wise I';m planing just stronger spar, carbon stripe in each wing, carbon rods on sides of fuse - nothing to crazy I think. I know the key is to keep it light.

I know all this effort may not be necessary as it';s my first plane but I do enjoy building and personalising a lot and have hope it won';t be totalled on the first flight.

So far I have remover graphics servo linkages and relocated servos into tail. They are nice tight fit. Now working on ESC fit on top of the fuselage.

[attach=1]  [attach=2] [attach=3]

gb0wers

Probably worth putting crossweave tape on the wing leading edge and under the fuz - forgot this before.

Raf

Progress from today.

Printed modified motor mount that actually got 16/19mm bolt pattern and allow passing wires through without braking them - gosh they so stiff on these motors. Its slightly taller and make motor sticking out a bit more - need to alter space around motor.
Fitted ESC and exposed heat sink on it - it';s a massive ESC.

[attach=1]  [attach=2]  [attach=3]

[attach=4]  [attach=5]  [attach=6]

Two-Six

Wow nice job so far!  Very cool.

I love the printed motor mount.  I had hours of fun filing mine down so I could put a different motor in it and get its wires out the back.  Oh the pain!

Good job on sorting out the internals before you glue the fuz together.  Such foresight eludes me :-)
Nighthawk Pro, Trex 450 L Dominator 6 cell *FLOWN*, Blade 450-3D, MCPX-BL, MCPX-V2, Hubsan X4, Seagull Boomerang IC .40 trainer, HK Bixler, AXN Clouds fly,, Spektrum DX7, Taranis, AccuRC

gb0wers

Quote from: Raf on Wednesday,August 12, 2015, 20:36:20
<snip>
passing wires through without braking them - gosh they so stiff on these motors.
<More snip>

That';s because they are single wires, i.e. not multi-strand like they should be  :banghead: Utter sh1te sh1te design feature. I had an NTM motor in mine and needed to remove it a couple of times and one of the wires broke.................
I prefer the SK3 series.
Graham

DarrellW

+1 for sk3';s, very nice quality motor!
I think..........I think I am........therefore I am.............I think!

Raf

Thursday,August 13, 2015, 19:46:33 #19 Last Edit: Thursday,August 13, 2015, 19:52:12 by Raf
Done few things today.

1x6mm Carbon Fibre strips installed into wings.

[attach=1]  [attach=2]

The same in the tail horizontal stabiliser.

[attach=3]  [attach=4]

They are much stiffer now especially tail. Didn';t embed anything into vertical stabiliser it seem to be solid as it is.
These strips are much easier to work with then rods and job looks cleaner.

Fuselage. Added 3mm carbon rods in place of linkages and not top of wings where a lot of material have been removed for ESC and weakened structure. Servo cut outs also blocked.

[attach=5]  [attach=6]

A little hatch was cut out on side for access to APM and little deck for it cut from balsa. Will have to work out hinge and way to keep it close.

[attach=7]  [attach=8]

Removed wing tubes and some of internal ribs to allow easy battery fitment - a lot space to slide them inside fuselage - hopefully I';ll be able to balance it without any problem with or without FPV gear.
A deck from balsa was also cut (the same width as batteries) creating flat bottom which should also help with easy way to find perfect COG.

[attach=9]  [attach=10]  [attach=11]

I think I';ll lay some epoxy over Carbon rods and strips and let it cure over night.

gb0wers

Neat work, wish I';d put a deck in mine at that build stage, I';m having to do it now to fit the vector in.
Stuff can be velcro';d to the roof of the fuz under the wing if you wish - in that case flattening it now is easier.
Graham


Raf

Quote from: gb0wers on Thursday,August 13, 2015, 20:09:03
Neat work, wish I';d put a deck in mine at that build stage, I';m having to do it now to fit the vector in.
Stuff can be velcro';d to the roof of the fuz under the wing if you wish - in that case flattening it now is easier.
Graham


This is one of the reasons why I decided to build Bixler completely ready for FPV before I can actually fly. I won';t have a dilemma later "how to" and in the event of unfortunate rebuild it';s going to be easier - just follow was was done before and make eventual adjustments.

DarkButterfly

Quote from: Raf on Thursday,August 13, 2015, 21:04:27
This is one of the reasons why I decided to build Bixler completely ready for FPV before I can actually fly. I won';t have a dilemma later "how to" and in the event of unfortunate rebuild it';s going to be easier - just follow was was done before and make eventual adjustments.


That';s why I';ve decided to add all the AP/FPV gear to my wing before maiden, saves doing it later and then messing about re-balancing it.

Nice work on the build, going together well by looks of it ~~
Why use 4 motors when you can use 6?

YouTube channel
https://www.youtube.com/user/RobR386

Raf

Not a lot happened today but started on wiring.
Extended servo wires on wings

[attach=1]

Power module for APM, power plug, ESC connected, UBEC 6A-8A burst that should be sufficient and all routed. there will be still a lot room inside so I can place battery right on COG if needed.

[attach=2]  [attach=3]

gb0wers

Looking good.

I';m not sure if you are aware but there is evidence that extending the wires between the battery and esc can shorten the life of the esc, here is a thread I initiated in another forum some time ago - have a read and make your own mind up about your build. I have to say that I consider the contributor PDR to "know his stuff". http://www.rcmf.co.uk/4um/electric-flight-discussions/extending-esc-input-wires/msg757995/#msg757995

I put the esc in my Bix2 in the same place as yours, but brought the (unextended) esc wires forward to the battery bay from where you have made your splice. I did splice in from there to send a supply back to my FPV gear.

I hope I haven';t given you an unnecessary headache but better to know about a potential issue up front.

Graham






Raf

Friday,August 14, 2015, 23:26:45 #25 Last Edit: Saturday,August 15, 2015, 01:05:05 by Raf
Quote from: gb0wers on Friday,August 14, 2015, 21:53:44 I put the esc in my Bix2 in the same place as yours, but brought the (unextended) esc wires forward to the battery bay from where you have made your splice. I did splice in from there to send a supply back to my FPV gear.

I hope I haven';t given you an unnecessary headache but better to know about a potential issue up front.

Graham


Well headache or not I';m glad you said something Graham. I never came across this subject before. You learn everyday something new  :smiley: Thanks  ~~
Anyhow that';s the result of it - shaved 30cm of cable. Well need to think about mounting it to the side wall - canopy magnet will go.

[attach=1]

Edit: redone is again as it would be quite difficult plug in battery. Pics to follow tomorrow as it';s to late now.

Raf

So there you have it. I think power supply routing is done. Next thing to do is sort out APM output connections.

[attach=1]  [attach=2]


Raf

Progress so far.

All wiring done and placed. Motor mount glued in place, ESC, Power Module, UBEC, APM mini, MinimOSD, GPS all placed all connections made. ESC, motor and so on was checked and tested. Pictures just before glueing fuselage together.

[attach=1]  [attach=2]  [attach=3]

[attach=4]  [attach=5] 

and after glueing fuselage

[attach=6]  [attach=7]  [attach=8]

[attach=9]  [attach=10]

Battery bay - lost of room

[attach=11]  [attach=12]  [attach=13]

[attach=14]

Wings are almost done. Receiver and video transmitter also mounted. Just need mount servos in place and route all connections - pics to follow.

Raf

Thursday,August 27, 2015, 20:41:59 #28 Last Edit: Thursday,August 27, 2015, 23:06:39 by Raf
Slowly but surely we are getting there  :smiley:

Done some fuselage surgery allowing better access to battery bay also creating more space for FPV pod.

[attach=1]  [attach=2]

after cutting

[attach=3]  [attach=4]

I designed and 3D printed surround for new opening. Fuselage wrapped with covering film.

[attach=5]  [attach=6]  [attach=7]

[attach=8]


Raf

Sneak peek - I';m sure is going to be visible  :laugh:

[attach=1]  [attach=2]