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Author Topic: Robocat 270mm  (Read 228 times)

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Offline Dippi

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Robocat 270mm
« on: August 12, 2017, 22:31:57 »
Please see the pictures attached.

After trying out F450 and s500 builds using Naza M lite, decided to go for a smaller build.

The S500 was a better build for me frame wise, as i tried both f450 and s500 with the same Naza Fc. This got me thinking to go for a smaller build.
Its been some days now since i ordered the parts and as they trickle by, more questions keep popping in my mind.

The current frame is a CF Robocat 270mm.

The Fc's have still not come in, am planning to try 2 different Fc's.

1) PRO SP Racing F3 Flight Controller Integrate OSD

2) Flight Controller Betaflight Raceflight Firmware for LUX DIY FPV

I have used an XT60 PDB.

Q1. should i use a hot glue gun to cover the soldered parts, or

Q2. how should i cover the pdb so that there is no chance of a short as the frame is Carbon fibre.

Q3. Which Propellers to use

1. Gemfan 5*3 5030 Plastic Prop 3 Blades Propeller OR
2. BULLNOSE Propellers Prop 5045

Q4. How do i tighten the propeller nuts properly?

Right now the props are loose and the nut is stuck at this point, refer pic.  Are the nuts supposed to tighten all the way till the props don't free spin?

Q5. What is the right way to fix the props and the prop nuts?

Q6. Is Littlebee 30a esc good enough?

Q6a. Do i need to some how program the esc's?

ESC details:

Description:
 
[[[[[

1:input Voltage:2-6S Lipo
2: NO BEC
3:Continue Current:30A,Burst Current:35A up to 10S
4:Size: 35*17mm.
5:Weight:9g(include Power and signal wire)
6:Support Damped mode,Oneshot125,Oneshot42 and Multshot and DSHOT
7:Main IC:SILABS EFM8BB21F16 ,MCU run 48MHz
8:MOS:Both low and high side fets are Nfets
9:Switching speed is very fast,it has dedicated driver chip
10:BLHeli S Bootloader & Firmware

]]]]]

Q7. Are motors rs2205 2300kv strong enough?

I have soldered the motor cords to the esc and the esc to the PDB, is that ok, or should i use bullet connectors?













Offline Bajadre

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Re: Robocat 270mm
« Reply #1 on: August 12, 2017, 23:47:52 »
looking good matey  ~~ one of our guys runs a robocat great frames can take a knock and I like that you can mod the canopies too :cool:
Emax nighthawk 280,Emax x4,Blade 350qx3,dx6 (gen2),fatshark doms v2.

Offline Cheredanine

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Re: Robocat 270mm
« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2017, 00:34:50 »
Please see the pictures attached.

After trying out F450 and s500 builds using Naza M lite, decided to go for a smaller build.

The S500 was a better build for me frame wise, as i tried both f450 and s500 with the same Naza Fc. This got me thinking to go for a smaller build.
Its been some days now since i ordered the parts and as they trickle by, more questions keep popping in my mind.

The current frame is a CF Robocat 270mm.
So we are clear, the robocat is a heavy frame, the 270 can handle 6 inch props
Quote
The Fc's have still not come in, am planning to try 2 different Fc's.

1) PRO SP Racing F3 Flight Controller Integrate OSD

2) Flight Controller Betaflight Raceflight Firmware for LUX DIY FPV
The spr f3 doesn't have an osd, the second point is just plain gibberish, lux is a different board and raceflight and betaflight are completely different flight control softwares, one is open source, the other is proprietary, perhaps a link to where you are getting this from?
Quote
I have used an XT60 PDB.

Q1. should i use a hot glue gun to cover the soldered parts, or

Generally no, only if you are conecerned about strength or connectivity
Quote
Q2. how should i cover the pdb so that there is no chance of a short as the frame is Carbon fibre.
Make sure the pdb isn't touching the frame, any ammount of cover will wear
Quote
Q3. Which Propellers to use

1. Gemfan 5*3 5030 Plastic Prop 3 Blades Propeller OR
2. BULLNOSE Propellers Prop 5045
Try and avoid bullnosed, they are very inefficient, it depends on motors, lipo cell count and what escs you have, but probably look for something with more power
Quote
Q4. How do i tighten the propeller nuts properly?
Assuming they are nyloc nuts, just tighten them with a spanner, no point in worrying about clockwise/anti-clockwise it is unnecessary with nyloc
Quote
Right now the props are loose and the nut is stuck at this point, refer pic.  Are the nuts supposed to tighten all the way till the props don't free spin?
Yep
Quote
Q5. What is the right way to fix the props and the prop nuts?
In what way are they broken?
Quote
Q6. Is Littlebee 30a esc good enough?
Depends on motors, props and lipo but most probably yes
Quote
Q6a. Do i need to some how program the esc's?

ESC details:

Description:
 
[[[[[

1:input Voltage:2-6S Lipo
2: NO BEC
3:Continue Current:30A,Burst Current:35A up to 10S
4:Size: 35*17mm.
5:Weight:9g(include Power and signal wire)
6:Support Damped mode,Oneshot125,Oneshot42 and Multshot and DSHOT
7:Main IC:SILABS EFM8BB21F16 ,MCU run 48MHz
8:MOS:Both low and high side fets are Nfets
9:Switching speed is very fast,it has dedicated driver chip
10:BLHeli S Bootloader & Firmware

]]]]]
Those a blheli_s, you can program through the fc with betaflight, they should be fine
Quote
Q7. Are motors rs2205 2300kv strong enough?
Hmm, I would want something with more torque and lower kv and run 6 inch tri blades I think, but they can spin decent 5 inch props
Quote
I have soldered the motor cords to the esc and the esc to the PDB, is that ok, or should i use bullet connectors?
Yes that is fine
Quote




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Offline Dippi

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Re: Robocat 270mm
« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2017, 07:57:34 »
The FC: I have ordered them from Aliexpress, Do you think they are some cheap clones?

Would you recommend certain FC [ something that is good for racing and FPV and easy to configure] and the website from where to buy.

Links of the FC's:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/PRO-SP-Racing-F3-Flight-Controller-Integrate-OSD-with-Protective-Case-Mini-250-210-Quadcopter/32695631938.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.IMO2Ik

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Sparky-Flight-Controller-Tau-Labs-10dof-CC3D-Upgrade-quadcopter-QAV250-400-FPV/32363907901.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.IMO2Ik

What props would you recommend? and a link please.

About the esc, i think i have not explained them correctly.

I have Littlebee 30a esc's running Blheli and they have these different options multi shot, one shot shot.
Which of these should i use and one, multi or d. do the esc select these options automatically or everything is done through the Fc through clean flight or beta flight.

Are all FC able to connect to beta flight and clean flight. Which of these, BF or CF is the better option.
Would you recommend a certain video to follow.

I still haven't received the FC's and i have Naza m lite and that is definitely not for this kind of fc for this build.

I think i will first learn to control the quad with these motors and then go for stronger ones, would you recommend something, link please.

How to take care of motors, do i need to oil them or grease them? Would you recommend something. Sorry i have no idea about these things.


Thank you, for your time.


Offline Cheredanine

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Re: Robocat 270mm
« Reply #4 on: August 13, 2017, 10:14:36 »
The FC: I have ordered them from Aliexpress, Do you think they are some cheap clones?

Would you recommend certain FC [ something that is good for racing and FPV and easy to configure] and the website from where to buy.

Links of the FC's:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/PRO-SP-Racing-F3-Flight-Controller-Integrate-OSD-with-Protective-Case-Mini-250-210-Quadcopter/32695631938.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.IMO2Ik

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Sparky-Flight-Controller-Tau-Labs-10dof-CC3D-Upgrade-quadcopter-QAV250-400-FPV/32363907901.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.IMO2Ik
Hi mate,
So most definatley neither are origional.
Let's deal with the lux first.
That is a clone of the v1 lux.
I use pd the v1 a lot it was a nice flight controller. It's only issue is the use of the mpu6500 gyro which has a vulnerability to noise, if you soft mount it then it should be fine.
That assumes they have done a decent job of cloning it and the build quality is as good as the origional.

The first one is way out, they call it an sprf3 delux but it is not a direct clone, they have modified e board in all sorts of ways, I suspect it uses the spr f3 target firmware. I would be very dubious to be honest. The origional spr f3 has a number of issues, it uses the same gyro as the lux, the gyro connectivity is i2c, not spi so is limited to 4khz, it uses jst connectors which tend to break

A lot of these Chinese clones have questionable build quality and the ability to get replacements/customer service is naff.

Out of the two I would use the lux. On top of everything else it is easier to work with

I tend to buy flight controllers from hobbyrc or electric wingman, I also use unmanned tech and recently dronebit.co.uk for raceflight

I use a fair few different ones depending on what I want, they are surmised below:

Nero f7 - nice simple f7 flight controller for fpv racers, no whistles or bells but board is designed by one of the lead bf devs. Needs a 5v pololu, doesn't have built in osd but rock solid
Bluejay f4 - previous version of the Nero, same details. By far the most prevalent flight controller I have (in 6-8 of my racers at the moment)
Lumenier lux v2 - f3 flight controller absolutely rock solid, has built in 5v reg, again no additional whistles and bells
Rotorgeeks SSD- same details as lux
DTFC - combined f3 fc and pdb, uses an osdoge to get osd and clean video, the combination is excellent but is now end of life I believe
Matek f4 and seperate pdb with ribbon connector - actually quite good, would be a bit wary of sticking in high end racer but has everything but escs on 2 boards
Airbot asguard (also lumenier asguard and posiden - same board rebranded) a true aio including escs, works very well but always has the problem of blow any component you have to replace the whole thing

For any of these stuff you want-
Sd card reader - essential for bb logging
Spi gyro capable of 32khz
Ideally f4 or later

As above I also recently built a raceflight quad, I do like it for a number of reasons - firstly set up - raceflight uses a wizard approach, for a beginer it is a piece of cake to set up. Secondly support, it is proprietary, unlike the open source community approach of bf or cf, there is a channel on slack
That said, I run bf on all my other quads
Quote
What props would you recommend? and a link please.
Tough one
I think probably try gemfan flash:
http://www.hobbyrc.co.uk/gemfan-flash-5152-3-props-2x-cw-2x-ccw-black
To start with, consider trying 6 inch but they may be a bit much for the motors:
http://www.hobbyrc.co.uk/6-inch-props
Quote
About the esc, i think i have not explained them correctly.

I have Littlebee 30a esc's running Blheli and they have these different options multi shot, one shot shot.
Which of these should i use and one, multi or d. do the esc select these options automatically or everything is done through the Fc through clean flight or beta flight.
So first thing, there are flavours of blheli
The origional blheli
Blheli_s
Blheli32

The ones you describe are blheli_s
They will automatically detect the protocol you use.
You set the protocol in th flight controller

Dshot is a better protocol than oneshot/multishot, the latter are pwm based, Dshot is digital, it is more accurate, tolerant to error, it doesn't need calibration. A quad without issue there would be no noticeable difference in flight between pwm based and dshot but not all quads are not perfect
The number in dshot is the frame rate, the higher, the quicker the signal gets to the he esc and the motor starts reacting, whilst that isn't relevant to your stick input as they are all very quick, it is relevant to commands from the fc. So set it in bf on the config tab to dshot600, don't calibrate the escs - there is no point
The only reason you would have to connect to the escs is to flash a new version of blheli or to reverse motor direction of a given motor. You can do this by plugging in the flight controller like you are gonna connect to bf but instead of starting configurator start blheli suite

Quote
Are all FC able to connect to beta flight and clean flight. Which of these, BF or CF is the better option.
Would you recommend a certain video to follow.
Bf
There is a wiki and loads of videos, try people like painless360 and josh bardwell
Wiki link:
https://github.com/betaflight/betaflight/wiki
Quote
I still haven't received the FC's and i have Naza m lite and that is definitely not for this kind of fc for this build.

I think i will first learn to control the quad with these motors and then go for stronger ones, would you recommend something, link please.
https://www.electricwingman.com/returner-r4-2300kv
Or
https://www.electricwingman.com/f40-pro-2400
Quote
How to take care of motors, do i need to oil them or grease them? Would you recommend something. Sorry i have no idea about these things.
Keep them clean, use compressed air to remove dirt. If the bell is held in place with a screw, adjust if you develop verticle play but otherwise no need to mess around
Quote
Thank you, for your time.
No problem, we all had to learn some time

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Offline Dippi

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Re: Robocat 270mm
« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2017, 10:38:57 »

Lumenier lux v2 - f3 flight controller absolutely rock solid, has built in 5v reg, again no additional whistles and bells

Lost a bit on the next 4 lines

For any of these stuff you want-
Sd card reader - essential for bb logging
Spi gyro capable of 32khz
Ideally f4 or later

As above I also recently built a raceflight quad, I do like it for a number of reasons - firstly set up - raceflight uses a wizard approach, for a beginer it is a piece of cake to set up. Secondly support, it is proprietary, unlike the open source community approach of bf or cf, there is a channel on slack
That said, I run bf on all my other quadsTough one

Ok between the Lumier v2 and race flight what would be an easier first choice. (to build connect the different components. First stage have a flying Racer, second stage add the FPv and 3rd stage debugging. Actually could you explain more, why would i need to use that feature)



The ones you describe are blheli_s
They will automatically detect the protocol you use.
You set the protocol in th flight controller

Is BLheli s Spring same as the BLheli S?

Out of the different stores which one would you highly recommend which is economical or has decent prices doesn't charge excessive postage and i will not end up paying customs here in finland (Max €44 without customs within Europe)

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Re: Robocat 270mm
« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2017, 10:58:00 »
I guess there are 2 different models of Raceflight fc on drone bit.co.uk, which one would you highly recommend and why.

Also it say on their product page that those are pre configured for FRsky and spectrum, but can be used with other  RX and tx. Do you think it will be easy to set it up with FLysky fsi6 TX using either fsia6b or fsia10b RX.

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Re: Robocat 270mm
« Reply #7 on: August 13, 2017, 11:05:55 »
Those 4 lines are specifcations to look for on a bf flight controller

Raceflight, there are three boards, they are all essentially the same thing-
Raceflight revolt - this is the raceflight board
Millivolt - this is the same board but in a smaller form factor (20mmx20mm mount holes, it will not fit on an standard 5 inch quad)
Revolt skitzo edition - essentially the same as the revolt with a different silk screen

For yours you would need the raceflight revolt
Note the revolt meets all the criteria above except sd card, however it has onboard flash and decent download for logging through the raceflight app

Note before you get concerned, the revolt will work fine with your escs, and it will do it all for you, you don't need blheli suite, it will, with a wizard, set up the escs as part of the quad setup
« Last Edit: August 13, 2017, 11:09:04 by Cheredanine »