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Author Topic: Near miss  (Read 909 times)

Offline Bad Raven

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Near miss
« on: December 06, 2017, 10:56:21 »
A RC club has operated in airport outer airspace with long standing airport permissions for 400', relevant authority and planning permissions, and is permanently on NOTAMS and marked on all maps/charts. It has done this in conjunction with the airport ATC operation with their knowledge, permissions and NO incidents or issues have arisen for over twenty years.

Yesterday a large Agusta Helicopter, believed a regular if not resident (investigating), leaving the airport stayed far FAR too low and overflew the working RC site at great speed with no warning from behind tree cover.  Not only the height, but also the direction was very abnormal, well under the usual height and position.

Only alertness by RC fliers on site flying planes at around 200' max diving out of its way, one as a result force landing off strip with gear damage, prevented the likelihood of an impact incident.

The club ALWAYS operates to the rules, every and all the time flying takes place, which is nearly every day, so you'd think regular airport users (as this almost certainly was) would know (and have checked as they are supposed to do) and act accordingly.   :shrug:

No guesses which way it would have gone if contact had occurred with this damn cowboy!   :banghead:

Offline Bajadre

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Re: Near miss
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2017, 13:06:53 »
hope they reported the chopper pilot for not following rules etc like you said it would of been other way around would be all over the front pages I expect lol  :banghead:
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Online UrbanFPV

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Re: Near miss
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2017, 13:07:31 »
This should be reported to the CAA as an AIRPROX - if helicopter pilot was flying illegally low. 
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Offline Lamaule

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Re: Near miss
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2017, 20:48:28 »
This should be reported to the CAA as an AIRPROX - if helicopter pilot was flying illegally low.

Agreed, and the CAA will commend the good practice!

Offline LuMan

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Re: Near miss
« Reply #4 on: December 07, 2017, 15:52:32 »
This is an interesting topic. The RC club where I fly is in close proximity to an international airport and while I've never seen big jets getting close I have seen some GA aircraft milling overhead a bit lower than I would have thought safe. Certainly below 400ft.

Last November I flew my S550 up to approximately 400ft, checking that the GPS was set correctly to top out at 350ft. About 5 minutes later a club Cessna tootled over the field so low that even my father in law commented that it seemed lower than what I was flying.

Had there been a collision (God forbid), at least I could have pulled the GPS data from my video to prove I was within the law. Whether or not it would have held water is another thing, however.....
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Offline Elmattbo

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Re: Near miss
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2017, 00:02:37 »
Why do you think it wouldn’t have been accepted? I don’t think there is a conspiracy against rc pilots. If you’re flying legally then you have no case to answer, end of. In the eyes of the CAA, any judge and the aviation community at large as well.


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Offline Steve J

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Re: Near miss
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2017, 18:27:41 »
Yesterday a large Agusta Helicopter, believed a regular if not resident (investigating), leaving the airport stayed far FAR too low and overflew the working RC site at great speed with no warning from behind tree cover.  Not only the height, but also the direction was very abnormal, well under the usual height and position.

Only alertness by RC fliers on site flying planes at around 200' max diving out of its way, one as a result force landing off strip with gear damage, prevented the likelihood of an impact incident.

I'll echo what has been said above, raise an airprox and contact the airport.

A few airproxes have been raised this year by UAV pilots and in none of these have the airprox board been critical of the UAV pilot. 2017100 is a good example, a coastguard helicopter flew low over Beaulieu airfield and a UAV pilot took evasive action, from the report -

Quote
Members noted that the former Beaulieu airfield is a VRP and has a recognised and active model aircraft site and as such, the AW189 operating authority may wish to take this into account.

Steve

Offline DarrellW

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Re: Near miss
« Reply #7 on: December 09, 2017, 12:45:19 »
Where I fly we are quite close to Bobbington airport where a lot of training and some displays go on. We often have planes flying too low around our site and regularly report the incidents, despite this NO action!!!
We have tried to sort this out with the Airport, but so far no improvement; we have decided to fully document the next time to the authorities I.e. the CAA for their comments.................

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Offline Russ_H

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Re: Near miss
« Reply #8 on: December 28, 2017, 18:43:56 »
Raven, can you tell me exactly where this site is, that way I can check if there is/was a restriction, permanent, or tempory via NOTAM ?
Thanks

I can help

Offline Russ_H

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Re: Near miss
« Reply #9 on: December 28, 2017, 18:50:26 »
This is an interesting topic. The RC club where I fly is in close proximity to an international airport and while I've never seen big jets getting close I have seen some GA aircraft milling overhead a bit lower than I would have thought safe. Certainly below 400ft.

Last November I flew my S550 up to approximately 400ft, checking that the GPS was set correctly to top out at 350ft. About 5 minutes later a club Cessna tootled over the field so low that even my father in law commented that it seemed lower than what I was flying.

Had there been a collision (God forbid), at least I could have pulled the GPS data from my video to prove I was within the law. Whether or not it would have held water is another thing, however.....

 Luman your post prompts me to clear up something that often causes confusion, the low flying rules in the ANO state that an aircraft is not to fly within 500ft of a person, vehicle, or structure, people sometimes mistakenly beleive it means an aircraft shouldnt fly below 500ft AGL, it is of course quite legal to fly at 100ft, the 500ft seperation includes any horizontal displacement .

sorry if I'm teaching Granny to suck eggs, but I'm sure at least one person who reads this didnt know, but now does.

Offline Elmattbo

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Re: Near miss
« Reply #10 on: December 29, 2017, 03:07:15 »
Luman your post prompts me to clear up something that often causes confusion, the low flying rules in the ANO state that an aircraft is not to fly within 500ft of a person, vehicle, or structure, people sometimes mistakenly beleive it means an aircraft shouldnt fly below 500ft AGL, it is of course quite legal to fly at 100ft, the 500ft seperation includes any horizontal displacement .

sorry if I'm teaching Granny to suck eggs, but I'm sure at least one person who reads this didnt know, but now does.

Quite right Russ and well worth pointing out.  I’ve often heard (not necessarily on this forum) people say the airspace below 400’ is ‘ours’ which is, as you say, not true.


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Offline LuMan

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Re: Near miss
« Reply #11 on: December 29, 2017, 08:57:50 »
Luman your post prompts me to clear up something that often causes confusion, the low flying rules in the ANO state that an aircraft is not to fly within 500ft of a person, vehicle, or structure, people sometimes mistakenly beleive it means an aircraft shouldnt fly below 500ft AGL, it is of course quite legal to fly at 100ft, the 500ft seperation includes any horizontal displacement .

sorry if I'm teaching Granny to suck eggs, but I'm sure at least one person who reads this didnt know, but now does.

Hi Russ (and Elmattbo) - Yep, agree totally with what you're saying. My point is that any pilot should be aware of all other potential air activity taking place close to their intended route. We're an established club, and the airfield is fairly easily identifiable from the air (I know - I've flown over it  ;) ). Sharing airspace is all well and good, but it IS easier to ascertain proximity from the air than from the ground, and flying over an active model airfield at an altitude lower than the models isn't wise.
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Offline Russ_H

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Re: Near miss
« Reply #12 on: December 29, 2017, 16:15:00 »
I agree completely, just wanted to point out the legal side, common sense should of course be used, by both full size and model/drone pilots.

Heights are notoriously difficult to judge visually.

« Last Edit: December 29, 2017, 16:19:17 by Russ_H »